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France's research minister came to his job with grand plans to bring more fluidity to the nation's privileged research system. Although he now faces fierce resistance, he is determined to tough it out
PARIS-When geochemist Claude Allegre was appointed France's minister of national education, research, and technology in June 1997, French scientists thought they at long last had a colleague in their corner. Now many researchers are not so sure. Allegre has challenged many of the sacred cows of the French research system, including the "researcher-for-life" status of scientists employed by large public research organizations such as the Centre National de la Recherche Scientifique (CNRS). The minister's insistence that these civil service researchers develop closer ties with universities and industry has met fierce resistance, including a historic mass meeting of CNRS researchers last December (Science, 18 December 1998, p. 2162). Moreover, All&gre has been fighting on two fronts, as thousands of teachers have taken to the streets in recent weeks to protest his attempts to reform the nation's secondary schools. Some teachers' union leaders have even called for All&gre's resignation.
In an interview in his Paris office, Allegre outlines his rationale for the changes he wants to see in French research, and underscores his determination to push ahead with the reform program. An edited transcript follows.
Q: You are obviously a controversial person in France at the moment. Are you surprised at this strong reaction to your efforts to reform the nation's education and research establishments?
A: No, I am not surprised at all. There is resistance from some of the teachers' unions but, at the same time, the parents and students are completely with me. It is very difficult to reform education in this country, but I have the confidence of the government, so I am not very troubled about the resistance.
Q: Can you imagine any circumstances in which you would resign?
A: No. We are a democratic country, the government is not appointed by the unions. The pressure you are referring to is greatly amplified by the press, but it is not very strong on the street.
Q: At your request, Prime Minister Lionel Jospin recently appointed two Socialist parliamentary deputies to conduct an inquiry into research and the universities. What...